You Make the Set 5

[Thomas David Baker]

We are doing this in our Multiverse app:

http://mv.bluebones.net/

(Old shared Google spreadsheet for this is here:

https://docs.google.com/spreadsheet/ccc?key=0Ag7TtjWsLhYkdHBBUHF4RG... )

Channel Fireball just did Top 8 Mechanics:

* Retrace

* Dredge

* Landfall (not for attacking like Steppe Lynx - Grazing Gladehart and Roil Elemental style)

* Scry

* Flashback

* Kicker

* Flying

* Cycling

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SiNNg5aj-xo

I wonder if we could use that, or some of that, as the basis of You Make the Set 5.  I know that some of you were keen on Landfall.

Not sure when we would play it out but some time in late May probably?

[Thomas David Baker]

What is the purpose of the "number" column?

[Simon O'Keeffe]

The numbering system is how Wizards do it in their design file. Basically take the rarity, then the colour, then add an incrementing number. e.g.

(C)ommon + (W)hite + 01 = CW01

This is the identifier for a slot in the design file. This way if you have multiple cards that are aiming to fill a particular slot you can give them all the same number. As cards flavour and names change all the time but the slot is a constant.

Better explained here: http://www.wizards.com/Magic/magazine/Article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/mm/21

Given more time I would have created a Google doc as a design skeleton first and then added cards to it, but I think we all wanted to start collaborating sooner rather than later.

[Thomas David Baker]

Ah, so it is a mostly derived value?  If you shift something in rarity it's identifier changes.  We could probably just create the blank slots and do away with that value?

A spreadsheet is a good starting point because it is relatively painless to import into something else.  I would love to have proper comments (automatic author attribution and timestamp) and edit tracking though.

[Simon O'Keeffe]

Google doc's used to have author attribution and timestamping. I remember it from when we did the Modern Rotisserie. For some reason they have decided to remove that feature.

I think there is some basic edit tracking, you can go to Revision History in the file menu.

Regarding the card codes, they are not really used to uniquely identify specific cards, but the place in the set. As we are approaching it more from a "design some cards and make a set out of them", rather than "create a set and make some cards to go in it" maybe we can do away with them for now.

Thomas David Baker said:

Ah, so it is a mostly derived value?  If you shift something in rarity it's identifier changes.  We could probably just create the blank slots and do away with that value?

A spreadsheet is a good starting point because it is relatively painless to import into something else.  I would love to have proper comments (automatic author attribution and timestamp) and edit tracking though.

[Glenn Goldsworthy]

it would be really good if there was an easy way to show how many of a creature type there are?

I am gonna try and build the 45 to intigrate with everyone elses, that includes creature themes and card themes

[Simon O'Keeffe]

Hmm, no easy way in Google docs without combining all the existing cards. I think we are mainly aiming towards:

White - Clerics, Soldiers, Birds, Turtles

Blue - Wizards, Turtles

Black - Zombies, Wizards

Red - Wizards, Goblins

Green - Shamans/Druids, Beasts

I wouldn't worry about designing an exact 45 or worry too much about the creature types. We are going for a collaborative approach where we all design as many cards as we want, then we will do a development process as well to try and ensure nothing broken gets through and that we have sensible curves, creature types (if relevant), required effects, etc..

Glenn Goldsworthy said:

it would be really good if there was an easy way to show how many of a creature type there are?

I am gonna try and build the 45 to intigrate with everyone elses, that includes creature themes and card themes

[Kieran Symington]

I think we need some themes for Black, Red & Green. The 'top card' mechanic is really good and is making blue the easiest to design cards for, followed by White with lifegain. The remaining three are a bit all over the place right now, though everyone can share 'library manipulation' if we want that as our main set theme.

[Thomas David Baker]

Corrupt Seer is B don't forget.  I think they get to shift cards off the top more whereas U gets to reveal them more.

[Glenn Goldsworthy]

I haven't looked at the full list but how many cards out there do we have to hose this?  I have a couple on mind, not to sure of the final cards yet just a couple of ideas for ways to abuse them

Kieran Symington said:

I think we need some themes for Black, Red & Green. The 'top card' mechanic is really good and is making blue the easiest to design cards for, followed by White with lifegain. The remaining three are a bit all over the place right now, though everyone can share 'library manipulation' if we want that as our main set theme.

[Paul Hodgson]

if you have a couple of subtype columns you can run a quick pivot table that will tot up the numbers for you, can probably do something with vlookup as well

Simon O'Keeffe said:

Hmm, no easy way in Google docs without combining all the existing cards. I think we are mainly aiming towards:

White - Clerics, Soldiers, Birds, Turtles

Blue - Wizards, Turtles

Black - Zombies, Wizards

Red - Wizards, Goblins

Green - Shamans/Druids, Beasts

I wouldn't worry about designing an exact 45 or worry too much about the creature types. We are going for a collaborative approach where we all design as many cards as we want, then we will do a development process as well to try and ensure nothing broken gets through and that we have sensible curves, creature types (if relevant), required effects, etc..

Glenn Goldsworthy said:

it would be really good if there was an easy way to show how many of a creature type there are?

I am gonna try and build the 45 to intigrate with everyone elses, that includes creature themes and card themes

[Paul Hodgson]

if graveyard order still mattered you could have B use the top card of your GY (and each effect consume it in some way), or maybe a random card from your GY.

Creature kill B Sorcery

Exile target/random card from your/a GY, target creature gets -x/-x where x is that cards CMC

Kieran Symington said:

I think we need some themes for Black, Red & Green. The 'top card' mechanic is really good and is making blue the easiest to design cards for, followed by White with lifegain. The remaining three are a bit all over the place right now, though everyone can share 'library manipulation' if we want that as our main set theme.

[ross miles]

Green can have top card stuff, but more about what kind of card is reveal, creatures for more creatures, land for more land/mana ... There is allready a lot of stuff like this ... Lurking predators, or the guy who puts land into play ... Or the guy who becomes a 5/5 or adds mana, or the 7/7 who let's you play creature cards off the top of the library

If we make cards that care about top of library in green blue black (maybe all colours) but care in different ways then I'm sure interesting draft decks will occur ... Like with graveyard stuff from innistrad, to start with people stuck to the synegy in a collour before working out decks across colours like spider spawn deck

>Kieran Symington said:

I think we need some themes for Black, Red & Green. The 'top card' mechanic is really good and is making blue the easiest to design cards for, followed by White with lifegain. The remaining three are a bit all over the place right now, though everyone can share 'library manipulation' if we want that as our main set theme.