ROE Limited Tech Discussion - Mana or big dudes?

[Mark Walker]

Based on recent updates on the mothership, it would appear that ROE limited is going to be a much slower format, so I was wondering how you would evaluate the following:

Big Eldrazi
Acceleration
Removal, (not much around).
Bears
Level up guys

It would appear that the early game is spent either making levellers or mana accelerants ready for the eldrazi hitting the table from turn 7 onwards. The question is, which will have the highest premium, accelerators or eldrazi?

You can play the Eldrazi without accelerating, but with the annihilator mechanic, the first to get theirs down is way ahead. But if you pick the accelerants too high, you won't have the eldrazi to cast with them..

Discuss?

[Dan Barrett]

I think anything that kills/counters the inevitable Eldrazi your opponent will play is gonna be really important. Even the common/uncommon ones (the ones you're actually gonna see with any regularity in limited games) look like they can end a game fairly quickly.

I'm sure it will start off as "whoever plays an Eldrazi first wins", but i hope once we get used to the new limited environment it will be more than that.

[Paul Hodgson]

Given the high proportion of defenders, brood spawn and the game ending nature of Annihilator I think it's going to be (initially) like M10. Slow, board stalemates, pointless bears and game breaking must counter spells (e.g. overrun).

Holding on to removal to deal with ridiculous fatties will be a must, and anything with evasion is going to be a high pick. Raw card draw will also be at a premium, considering the devestating effect to your board position that being attacked by an annihilator critter will have.

Going to be interesting to see what/if any new Standard archetypes show up, turbofog is likely dead to the blessing effect of the eldrazi but not many std decks can play them - tap out UW probably can use Emrakul main as a card of I Win, the rest could stick one in the side for the Fog matchup.

[Mark Walker]

I think the 0/4 wall that taps for G for each defender you own is going to be high pick as it gets crazy in multiples.
The levellers as early drops require too much investment to become good, by which time your opponent has soaked up their effect and cast something huge.
Based on the numbers of eldrazi so far, you have to high pick them as everyone needs them. Take them first and then settle on the acceleration. Haven't seen much in the way of removal so far.

[Paul Hodgson]

Guess the Eldrazi are pseudo-removal, but still think that targetted 1:1 removal is going to be the first pick no matter the colour. Manabases will be stretchable to accommodate splashing for removal too, especially since your game ending bombs are all going to be colourless. Volume of mana, rather than colour will be key, and levellers give you places to sink it while you're building up to Elzradi summoning.

Will probably go Removal > Eldrazi (until you have 2/3) > Stalling (e.g. defenders) > Accelleration > Dudes

Mark Walker said:

I think the 0/4 wall that taps for G for each defender you own is going to be high pick as it gets crazy in multiples.
The levellers as early drops require too much investment to become good, by which time your opponent has soaked up their effect and cast something huge.
Based on the numbers of eldrazi so far, you have to high pick them as everyone needs them. Take them first and then settle on the acceleration. Haven't seen much in the way of removal so far.

[Gary Lynch]

Hard to predict how it will go by only seeing a few cards but they have shown us a couple of cards that produce spawn you can sac for mana. I think these will be really important as the have an effect on the game and provide the acceleration needed to make your eldrazi.

I think once people figure the format out a bit the eldrazi won't get picked quite so high. I'm sure even though they all look good some will probably have a bigger effect than others. Also a deck with huge spells and nothing to get you there isn good.

Agree with dan that anything that kills these mofos is probably gonna be a first pick. Also agree that the green defender is insane.

Mark Walker said:

I think the 0/4 wall that taps for G for each defender you own is going to be high pick as it gets crazy in multiples. The levellers as early drops require too much investment to become good, by which time your opponent has soaked up their effect and cast something huge. Based on the numbers of eldrazi so far, you have to high pick them as everyone needs them. Take them first and then settle on the acceleration. Haven't seen much in the way of removal so far.

[Louis Mackie]

From the defender's we've seen so far it looks like a powerful archetype. Both the Green and the Red ones with tap abilities seem pretty potent. I do hope it doesn't devolve into 'who annihilates first', with the keyword at common I hope we see either a lot of removal for these things or a ton of tokens to clutter the board.

[Paul Hodgson]

I think ton of tokens is pretty much a given, the red eldrazi drone gives you 3, skittering invasion spits out 5. Would be careful about relying on them in your overall plan though, we've seen a defender that pings players and wouldn't be surprised if there's one for critters as well.

Louis Mackie said:

From the defender's we've seen so far it looks like a powerful archetype. Both the Green and the Red ones with tap abilities seem pretty potent. I do hope it doesn't devolve into 'who annihilates first', with the keyword at common I hope we see either a lot of removal for these things or a ton of tokens to clutter the board.

[Thomas David Baker]

I hate to be boring but there's only 9 spoiled Commons out of 60 (80?) so you can't really tell much about draft.

Ulamog's Crusher, Guard Duty, Hyena Umbra, Knight of Cliffhaven, Mnemonic Wall, Emrakul's Hatcher, Vent Sentinel, Naturalize, Overgrown Battlement.

In an environment with nine Commons the first pickables are Guard Duty (turns off Ulamog's Crusher even if it has Hyena Umbra on it), Knight of Cliffhaven (only evasive Common in the set) and Ulamog's Crusher (if they don't have Guard Duty you win the game). The Defenders that don't accelerate you to Ulamog's Crusher seem pretty pointless as there's nothing they can block :)

One assumes that there more fliers, accelerants, removals spells and creatures will be spoiled ...