Cambridge PTQ

[Daniel Royde]

I heard a wild chifley appeared and top 8ed....?

[Martin Till]

Unfortunately your comments and others smack of being bad losers and of being a little arrogant. As you have said since I last posted you prob didn't mean anything by it but still calling other players bad is not the right thing to do.  After I got eliminated and was walking to car park I saw some of the other defeated quarterfinalist and asked who was left. The answer was "James and some crappy randomers" although I dont know who made the comment, it was not Chifley Cole but one of the others. Not exactly a respectful thing to say. Take the losses with the wins, we all know sometimes luck will play a part but its not advisable to call people bad players on a public forum as you normally get a reaction.

 

Good luck to you all in London

[Dan Barrett]

I don't have a problem with that, and you can tell me I'm bad anytime. In fact, you've done so very constructively on many occasions and for that I'm grateful. So long as that's always the tone it's done in (not "you're crap, get away from me before I catch your misplays", not that I think you'd ever say such a thing), then I'm all for it. ;)

 

My issue is with the feeling of "entitlement" better players have to beating less-good ones, when we're playing a game that has an element of luck.

 

Like, say someone played badly, and got lucky to win, sure, but to say they didn't deserve it at all is just rude, IMO.

[Charlie Grover]

You dont actually read our posts, just our tones. Im pretty sure I said i went 1-2 drop and still had a good day? I have no sense of entitilment to winning. I ran bad. It happens. Neither does chifley. Saying you played better than someone is not the same as saying you are entitled to beating them. Its a varaince game; it makes it more fun; ive beaten multiple world champions and lost to sub 1600-ranked players. You just both presumed we feel entitled because we said the player who <B> admitted to not being very good <B> is bad. Why shouldnt players be called bad? For the standard I want to be playing at I am bad. So are most people. Its not a judgement on the person. Being not as good as I want to be or feel I could be doesnt bother me, and im called out on it by Marco a lot of the time. Doesnt mean I dont like spending time with the person who calls me bad.....

On a side note, you are incredibly frustrating, because despite touting out the same points over and over about us pidgeonwholing worse players together into not being good enough, you call us arrogant kids,which is an appalling form of pidgeonwholing. Do you have any idea how utterly terrible that is as an argument? The only kids who play PTQ's regularly at the moment are me and Scoones, and compared to most magic players we are pretty pleasant to have around. Im a kid therefore I must be arrogant right? Because if you spent any time watching me at a tournament you would know I help those I can help and listen to anyone incase they have anything I can learn from.....

 

And as for the James and some randomers coment; it wasnt me but its almost true. Infact the top 4 was Iaonnis and some randomers. Being a randomer is also not an insult; it doesnt mean you cant be good. Im pretty sure Chifley was a randomer while he was top 8'ing then winning a PTQ. You are a randomer until you have done something that makes you known in England; there really are only about 20ish players in the UK who are not randomers to people who dont know them personally. Randomer isnt even an insult, it just means how good you are isnt really known, but given taht most of the good players in England do well because the play level isnt the highest they are presumed to be not amazing..

[Tom Reeve]

RAMBLE MODE ENGAGE

 

Sorry, but part of the problem with this is that people take descriptions of their ability to play Magic as some kind of judgment on their character. No-one benefits from that kind of mindset. You only get better, in ways small and large, by recognising that you did things badly, and you will get better a lot faster if you accept that some people are better than you and try to learn from them, either by watching them or talking to them. As for the 'entitled/deserving' thing, again, people seem to be treating it as some kind of moral judgment. Like saying you deserve to win a match more than the other person is some kind of slur, when it can just reflect the level of investment and attention given to the event and match. Losing to people who seem unprepared and make a lot of mistakes, and particularly losing to people because they make a lot of mistakes, is deeply frustrating when it matters.

 

There will, at any given event, be a broad spectrum of 'deserves to win' from 'turned up hungover not knowing the format, runs into on-board tricks constantly, isn't paying attention' to 'tested for months, knows the format backwards, predicted the metagame, tuned deck for it, playing well'. I doubt anyone would have any difficulty saying that the second player 'deserves' to win the event more, but they aren't 'entitled' to win it, and I cannot imagine either Charlie or Chifley ever saying such a thing (or, thankfully, pretty much any London players.)

 

tl;dr - some people are better or worse at Magic than others, this says nothing about them as people, and generally it is not helpful to anyone to pretend that this is not true, also people can deserve to win a thing more than other people without being entitled to win it

Martin Till said:

Unfortunately your comments and others smack of being bad losers and of being a little arrogant. As you have said since I last posted you prob didn't mean anything by it but still calling other players bad is not the right thing to do.  After I got eliminated and was walking to car park I saw some of the other defeated quarterfinalist and asked who was left. The answer was "James and some crappy randomers" although I dont know who made the comment, it was not Chifley Cole but one of the others. Not exactly a respectful thing to say. Take the losses with the wins, we all know sometimes luck will play a part but its not advisable to call people bad players on a public forum as you normally get a reaction.

 

Good luck to you all in London

[Gary Lynch]

MAD SKILLS!!

That Ginger One said:

Some girl called Carrie. And given that all of you know who I am you all know that I have social skills...

 

I think Dan has a problem with me saying someone is bad at magic. She is. The reason Vs. failed and Magic didnt was because bad players can win; higher variance. She did well to win a PTQ, but she could have played much better and her mistake in game 3 should have been punished but wasnt.

[Martin Till]

That Ginger One said:

You dont actually read our posts, just our tones. Im pretty sure I said i went 1-2 drop and still had a good day? I have no sense of entitilment to winning. I ran bad. It happens. Neither does chifley. Saying you played better than someone is not the same as saying you are entitled to beating them. Its a varaince game; it makes it more fun; ive beaten multiple world champions and lost to sub 1600-ranked players. You just both presumed we feel entitled because we said the player who <B> admitted to not being very good <B> is bad. Why shouldnt players be called bad? For the standard I want to be playing at I am bad. So are most people. Its not a judgement on the person. Being not as good as I want to be or feel I could be doesnt bother me, and im called out on it by Marco a lot of the time. Doesnt mean I dont like spending time with the person who calls me bad.....

On a side note, you are incredibly frustrating, because despite touting out the same points over and over about us pidgeonwholing worse players together into not being good enough, you call us arrogant kids,which is an appalling form of pidgeonwholing. Do you have any idea how utterly terrible that is as an argument? The only kids who play PTQ's regularly at the moment are me and Scoones, and compared to most magic players we are pretty pleasant to have around. Im a kid therefore I must be arrogant right? Because if you spent any time watching me at a tournament you would know I help those I can help and listen to anyone incase they have anything I can learn from.....

 

And as for the James and some randomers coment; it wasnt me but its almost true. Infact the top 4 was Iaonnis and some randomers. Being a randomer is also not an insult; it doesnt mean you cant be good. Im pretty sure Chifley was a randomer while he was top 8'ing then winning a PTQ. You are a randomer until you have done something that makes you known in England; there really are only about 20ish players in the UK who are not randomers to people who dont know them personally. Randomer isnt even an insult, it just means how good you are isnt really known, but given taht most of the good players in England do well because the play level isnt the highest they are presumed to be not amazing..

 

Think you missed my point. I have only replied twice before on this thread so not really going over and over again. I am not commenting on what you are writing but on the tone as you put it. Regardless of if someone is a good or bad player calling someone bad is something you should not publically mention. I agree she made some bad plays but havn't we all. Making a top 8 of a PTQ requires more than pure luck, she must have played well to win 5 of her games. Being called a randomer is not an insult unless it is said or written in a manner that makes it so and the way it was said in the car park was an insult.

 

Just for the record Ginger  and Chif I honestly believe you meant no offense with your original posts its just they have come across very bad.

[Chifley Cole]

This is so stupid. A bad player won the ptq, nobody is disagrees with that. People seem to have this weird notion that we should never mention the fact that she is bad? Or that somehow me saying that she is bad makes me arrogant and a bad loser?

 

I mean, when we talk about who deserved to win, we are talking about some hypothetical world where the better player wins everytime - it doesn't mean we think that magic actually is like that. We all know that winning a tournament is no indication of being deserving, beacuse the game of magic just doesn't do that. When we say someone deserved to win, we are just using different words to say that they were the better player. I guess there are people who don't like it when people state that, and would prefer we just went about pretending all magic players are equal. Nope, sorry, not going to do that. Deal with it.

 

I mean, saying someone is bad at magic isn't a character judgement.

 

Also Tom and Charlie seem to be giving me too much credit as a person; obviously I feel entitled to win each time every time. I am, after all, Chifley. You might have heard of me...

[Tom Reeve]

What's... a Chifley? Can I eat it? Is it bigger than a breadbox?

Chifley Cole said:

This is so stupid. A bad player won the ptq, nobody is disagrees with that. People seem to have this weird notion that we should never mention the fact that she is bad? Or that somehow me saying that she is bad makes me arrogant and a bad loser?

 

I mean, when we talk about who deserved to win, we are talking about some hypothetical world where the better player wins everytime - it doesn't mean we think that magic actually is like that. We all know that winning a tournament is no indication of being deserving, beacuse the game of magic just doesn't do that. When we say someone deserved to win, we are just using different words to say that they were the better player. I guess there are people who don't like it when people state that, and would prefer we just went about pretending all magic players are equal. Nope, sorry, not going to do that. Deal with it.

 

I mean, saying someone is bad at magic isn't a character judgement.

 

Also Tom and Charlie seem to be giving me too much credit as a person; obviously I feel entitled to win each time every time. I am, after all, Chifley. You might have heard of me...

[Charlie Grover]

ive seen some big breadboxes in my time...

[Paul Nonis]

and Mike Parker, for what its worth.

 

On an unrelated note, does anyone have a metagame breakdown?

That Ginger One said:

 

On a side note, you are incredibly frustrating, because despite touting out the same points over and over about us pidgeonwholing worse players together into not being good enough, you call us arrogant kids,which is an appalling form of pidgeonwholing. Do you have any idea how utterly terrible that is as an argument? The only kids who play PTQ's regularly at the moment are me and Scoones, and compared to most magic players we are pretty pleasant to have around. Im a kid therefore I must be arrogant right? Because if you spent any time watching me at a tournament you would know I help those I can help and listen to anyone incase they have anything I can learn from.....

 

[Chifley Cole]

Metagame Breakdown:

 

Bad Player - 40%

Random - 20%

Good Player - 20%

Arrogant Kid - 10%

Sore Loser - 5%

White Knight - 5%

 

Hope that helps you work out what kind of reply to choose for this thread. It sure is an exciting time to be posting on Demonic Tutor; it has been ages since we've seen a metagame this diverse!

[Tom Reeve]

I'm going to break the meta with my 'show up in fancy dress' tech!

Chifley Cole said:

Metagame Breakdown:

 

Bad Player - 40%

Random - 20%

Good Player - 20%

Arrogant Kid - 10%

Sore Loser - 5%

White Knight - 5%

 

Hope that helps you work out what kind of reply to choose for this thread. It sure is an exciting time to be posting on Demonic Tutor; it has been ages since we've seen a metagame this diverse!